#include <iostream>
#include <string>
#include <algorithm>
using namespace std;
string A,B;
int dp[2010][2010];
int bit(string &s,int i){
	if(s[i]=='*') return 2;
	if(s[i]=='?') return 1;
	return 0;
}
int ch(int i, int j){
	return 3*bit(A,i) + bit(B,j);
}
int main(){
	ios_base::sync_with_stdio(false);
	cin.tie(NULL);
	int i,j,n,m;
	cin >> A >> B;
	n = A.size(); m = B.size();
	for(i=0;i<=n;i++){
		for(j=0;j<=m;j++){
			dp[i][j] = 100000;
		}
	}
	dp[0][0] = 0;
	for(i=1;i<=m + 1;i++){
		dp[0][i] = dp[0][i-1] + 1;
		if(B[i-1]=='?' || B[i-1]=='*') dp[0][i]-=2;
	}
	for(i=1;i<=n + 1;i++){
		dp[i][0] = dp[i-1][0] + 1;
		if(A[i-1]=='?' || A[i-1]=='*') dp[i][0]-=2;
	}
	dp[0][0] = 0;
	for(i=1;i<=n;i++){
		for(j=1;j<=m;j++){
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==0){//moji_moji
				if(A[i-1]==B[j-1]){
					dp[i][j] = dp[i-1][j-1];
				}else{
					dp[i][j] = min({dp[i-1][j],dp[i][j-1],dp[i-1][j-1]}) + 1;
				}
			}
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==1){//moji_?
				dp[i][j] = min(dp[i][j-1],dp[i][j-2]);
			}
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==2){//moji_*
				dp[i][j] = min({dp[i][j-2],dp[i][j-1],dp[i-1][j] + (A[i-1]!=B[j-2])});
			}
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==3){//?_moji
				dp[i][j] = min({dp[i-1][j],dp[i-2][j]});
			}
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==4){//?_?
				dp[i][j] = min({dp[i-2][j-1],dp[i-1][j-2],dp[i-2][j-2]});
			}
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==5){//?_*
				dp[i][j] = min({dp[i-1][j],dp[i-2][j]});
			}
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==6){//*_moji
				dp[i][j] = min({dp[i-2][j],dp[i-1][j],dp[i][j-1] + (A[i-2]!=B[j-1])});
			}
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==7){//*_?
				dp[i][j] = min({dp[i][j-1],dp[i][j-2]});
			}
			if(ch(i-1,j-1)==8){//*_*
				dp[i][j] = min({dp[i-2][j-2],dp[i-2][j-1],dp[i-1][j-2],dp[i][j-1],dp[i-1][j]});
			}
		}
	}
	cout << dp[n][m] << endl;
}