import std.conv, std.functional, std.range, std.stdio, std.string;
import std.algorithm, std.array, std.bigint, std.complex, std.container, std.math, std.numeric, std.regex, std.typecons;
import core.bitop;

class EOFException : Throwable { this() { super("EOF"); } }
string[] tokens;
string readToken() { for (; tokens.empty; ) { if (stdin.eof) { throw new EOFException; } tokens = readln.split; } auto token = tokens.front; tokens.popFront; return token; }
int readInt() { return readToken.to!int; }
long readLong() { return readToken.to!long; }
real readReal() { return readToken.to!real; }

bool chmin(T)(ref T t, in T f) { if (t > f) { t = f; return true; } else { return false; } }
bool chmax(T)(ref T t, in T f) { if (t < f) { t = f; return true; } else { return false; } }

int binarySearch(alias pred, T)(in T[] as) { int lo = -1, hi = cast(int)(as.length); for (; lo + 1 < hi; ) { const mid = (lo + hi) >> 1; (unaryFun!pred(as[mid]) ? hi : lo) = mid; } return hi; }
int lowerBound(T)(in T[] as, T val) { return as.binarySearch!(a => (a >= val)); }
int upperBound(T)(in T[] as, T val) { return as.binarySearch!(a => (a > val)); }


string[] parse(string s) {
  const n = cast(int)(s.length);
  string[] ss;
  for (int i = 0; i < n; ) {
    if (i + 1 < n && (s[i + 1] == '?' || s[i + 1] == '*')) {
      ss ~= s[i .. i + 2];
      i += 2;
    } else {
      ss ~= s[i .. i + 1];
      i += 1;
    }
  }
  return ss;
}

void main() {
  try {
    for (; ; ) {
      const A = readToken();
      const B = readToken();
      
      const AA = A.parse;
      const BB = B.parse;
      const M = cast(int)(AA.length);
      const N = cast(int)(BB.length);
      debug {
        writeln("AA = ", AA);
        writeln("BB = ", BB);
      }
      
      auto dp = new int[][](M + 1, N + 1);
      foreach (i; 0 .. M + 1) foreach (j; 0 .. N + 1) {
        dp[i][j] = M + N + 1;
      }
      dp[0][0] = 0;
      foreach (i; 0 .. M + 1) foreach (j; 0 .. N + 1) {
        // skip
        if (i < M && AA[i].length == 2) {
          chmin(dp[i + 1][j], dp[i][j]);
        }
        if (j < N && BB[j].length == 2) {
          chmin(dp[i][j + 1], dp[i][j]);
        }
        
        // erase, insert
        if (i < M) {
          chmin(dp[i + 1][j], dp[i][j] + 1);
        }
        if (j < N) {
          chmin(dp[i][j + 1], dp[i][j] + 1);
        }
        
        // replace
        if (i < M && j < N) {
          const ii = (AA[i].length == 2 && AA[i][1] == '*') ? i : (i + 1);
          const jj = (BB[j].length == 2 && BB[j][1] == '*') ? j : (j + 1);
          const cost = (AA[i][0] == BB[j][0]) ? 0 : 1;
          chmin(dp[ii][jj], dp[i][j] + cost);
        }
      }
      debug {
        writeln("dp =");
        foreach (i; 0 .. M + 1) {
          writeln(dp[i]);
        }
      }
      writeln(dp[M][N]);
    }
  } catch (EOFException e) {
  }
}