#include <bits/stdc++.h>

#define rep(i, n) for (int i = 0; i < (n); i++)
#define repr(i, n) for (int i = (n) - 1; i >= 0; i--)
#define range(a) a.begin(), a.end()

using namespace std;
using ll = long long;

void chmin(int &x, int y) {
  x = min(x, y);
}

int main() {
  cin.tie(nullptr);
  ios::sync_with_stdio(false);
  string A, B; cin >> A >> B;
  const int N = A.size();
  const int M = B.size();
  vector<vector<int>> dp(N + 1, vector<int>(M + 1, 1e9));
  dp[0][0] = 0;
  rep(i, N+1) rep(j, M+1) {
    if (i < N && (A[i] == '*' || A[i] == '?')) chmin(dp[i+1][j], dp[i][j]);
    if (j < M && (B[j] == '*' || B[j] == '?')) chmin(dp[i][j+1], dp[i][j]);
    if (i + 1 < N && (A[i + 1] == '*' || A[i + 1] == '?')) chmin(dp[i+1][j], dp[i][j]);
    if (j + 1 < M && (B[j + 1] == '*' || B[j + 1] == '?')) chmin(dp[i][j+1], dp[i][j]);
    if (i < N) chmin(dp[i+1][j], dp[i][j] + 1);
    if (j < M) chmin(dp[i][j+1], dp[i][j] + 1);
    if (i < N && j < M && A[i] != '?' && B[j] != '?') {
      char x = A[i] == '*' ? A[i - 1] : A[i];
      char y = B[j] == '*' ? B[j - 1] : B[j];
      if (A[i] == '*' && B[j] == '*') {
      } else if (A[i] == '*') {
        chmin(dp[i][j+1], dp[i][j] + (x != y));
      } else if (B[j] == '*') {
        chmin(dp[i+1][j], dp[i][j] + (x != y));
      } else {
        chmin(dp[i+1][j+1], dp[i][j] + (x != y));
      }
    }
  }
  cout << dp[N][M] << endl;
}