#include <bits/stdc++.h>

using namespace std;

using ll = long long;
using P = pair<char, char>;

vector<P> calc(string& s) {
    int n = s.size();
    vector<P> res;
    for (int i = 0; i < n; ) {
        if (i < n - 1) {
            if (s[i + 1] == '?' || s[i + 1] == '*') {
                res.emplace_back(s[i], s[i + 1]);
                i += 2;
            } else {
                res.emplace_back(s[i], s[i]);
                i++;
            }
        } else {
            res.emplace_back(s[i], s[i]);
            break;
        }
    }
    return res;
}

const int INF = 1e9;

int main() {
    cin.tie(0);
    ios::sync_with_stdio(false);
    string a, b;
    cin >> a >> b;

    vector<P> va = calc(a);
    vector<P> vb = calc(b);

    int na = va.size();
    int nb = vb.size();

    vector< vector<int> > dp(na + 1, vector<int>(nb + 1, INF));
    dp[0][0] = 0;
    for (int i = 1; i <= na; i++) {
        dp[i][0] = dp[i - 1][0];
        if (va[i - 1].second == '?' || va[i - 1].second == '*') continue;
        dp[i][0]++;
    }

    for (int i = 1; i <= nb; i++) {
        dp[0][i] = dp[0][i - 1];
        if (vb[i - 1].second == '?' || vb[i - 1].second == '*') continue;
        dp[0][i]++;
    }

    for (int i = 0; i < na; i++) {
        for (int j = 0; j < nb; j++) {
            int cost = (va[i].first != vb[j].first);
            int hoge = dp[i][j];
            if (va[i].second == '*') hoge = min(hoge, dp[i + 1][j]);
            if (vb[j].second == '*') hoge = min(hoge, dp[i][j + 1]);
            dp[i + 1][j + 1] = min({
                dp[i + 1][j + 1],
                hoge + cost,
                dp[i][j + 1] + (va[i].first == va[i].second),
                dp[i + 1][j] + (vb[j].first == vb[j].second)
            });
        }
    }

    /*
    for (int i = 0; i <= na; i++) {
        for (int j = 0; j <= nb; j++) {
            cerr << i << " " << j << ": " << dp[i][j] << endl;
        }
    }//*/
    cout << dp[na][nb] << endl;
    return 0;
}