package contest190830;
import java.io.ByteArrayInputStream;
import java.io.IOException;
import java.io.InputStream;
import java.io.PrintWriter;
import java.util.Arrays;
import java.util.InputMismatchException;

public class E3 {
	InputStream is;
	PrintWriter out;
	String INPUT = "";
	
	void solve()
	{
		Datum a = new Datum(ns().toCharArray());
		Datum b = new Datum(ns().toCharArray());
		
		int n = a.cs.length, m = b.cs.length;
		int[][] dp = new int[n+1][m+1];
		for(int i = 0;i <= n;i++) {
			for(int j = 0;j <= m;j++) {
				if(i == 0 && j == 0)continue;
				int min = 999999999;
				if(i-1 >= 0) {
					int erase = 0;
					if(a.con[i-1] > 0) {
						erase = 0;
					}else {
						erase = 1;
					}
					min = Math.min(min, dp[i-1][j] + erase);
				}
				if(j-1 >= 0) {
					int add = 0;
					if(b.con[j-1] > 0) {
						add = 0;
					}else {
						add = 1;
					}
					min = Math.min(min, dp[i][j-1] + add);
				}
				if(i-1 >= 0 && j-1 >= 0) {
					if(a.con[i-1] == 0 && b.con[j-1] == 0) {
						min = Math.min(min, dp[i-1][j-1] + (a.cs[i-1] != b.cs[j-1] ? 1 : 0));
					}else if(a.con[i-1] == 2) {
						min = Math.min(min, Math.min(dp[i-1][j-1], dp[i][j-1]) + (b.cs[j-1] != a.cs[i-1] && b.con[j-1] == 0 ? 1 : 0));
					}else if(b.con[j-1] == 2) {
						min = Math.min(min, Math.min(dp[i-1][j-1], dp[i-1][j]) + (b.cs[j-1] != a.cs[i-1] && a.con[i-1] == 0 ? 1 : 0));
					}else if(a.con[i-1] == 1) {
						min = Math.min(min, dp[i-1][j-1] + (b.cs[j-1] != a.cs[i-1] && b.con[j-1] == 0 ? 1 : 0));
					}else {
						min = Math.min(min, dp[i-1][j-1] + (b.cs[j-1] != a.cs[i-1] && a.con[i-1] == 0 ? 1 : 0));
					}
				}
				dp[i][j] = min;
			}
		}
		out.println(dp[n][m]);
	}
	
	static class Datum
	{
		char[] cs;
		int[] con;
		public Datum(char[] s) {
			int n = s.length;
			cs = new char[n];
			con = new int[n];
			int p = 0;
			for(int i = 0;i < n;i++) {
				cs[p] = s[i];
				if(i+1 < n && s[i+1] == '?') {
					con[p] = 1;
					i++;
				}else if(i+1 < n && s[i+1] == '*') {
					con[p] = 2;
					i++;
				}else {
					con[p] = 0;
				}
				p++;
			}
			cs = Arrays.copyOf(cs, p);
			con = Arrays.copyOf(con, p);
		}
	}
	
	void run() throws Exception
	{
		is = INPUT.isEmpty() ? System.in : new ByteArrayInputStream(INPUT.getBytes());
		out = new PrintWriter(System.out);
		
		long s = System.currentTimeMillis();
		solve();
		out.flush();
		if(!INPUT.isEmpty())tr(System.currentTimeMillis()-s+"ms");
//		Thread t = new Thread(null, null, "~", Runtime.getRuntime().maxMemory()){
//			@Override
//			public void run() {
//				long s = System.currentTimeMillis();
//				solve();
//				out.flush();
//				if(!INPUT.isEmpty())tr(System.currentTimeMillis()-s+"ms");
//			}
//		};
//		t.start();
//		t.join();
	}
	
	public static void main(String[] args) throws Exception { new E3().run(); }
	
	private byte[] inbuf = new byte[1024];
	public int lenbuf = 0, ptrbuf = 0;
	
	private int readByte()
	{
		if(lenbuf == -1)throw new InputMismatchException();
		if(ptrbuf >= lenbuf){
			ptrbuf = 0;
			try { lenbuf = is.read(inbuf); } catch (IOException e) { throw new InputMismatchException(); }
			if(lenbuf <= 0)return -1;
		}
		return inbuf[ptrbuf++];
	}
	
	private boolean isSpaceChar(int c) { return !(c >= 33 && c <= 126); }
	private int skip() { int b; while((b = readByte()) != -1 && isSpaceChar(b)); return b; }
	
	private double nd() { return Double.parseDouble(ns()); }
	private char nc() { return (char)skip(); }
	
	private String ns()
	{
		int b = skip();
		StringBuilder sb = new StringBuilder();
		while(!(isSpaceChar(b))){ // when nextLine, (isSpaceChar(b) && b != ' ')
			sb.appendCodePoint(b);
			b = readByte();
		}
		return sb.toString();
	}
	
	private char[] ns(int n)
	{
		char[] buf = new char[n];
		int b = skip(), p = 0;
		while(p < n && !(isSpaceChar(b))){
			buf[p++] = (char)b;
			b = readByte();
		}
		return n == p ? buf : Arrays.copyOf(buf, p);
	}
	
	private int[] na(int n)
	{
		int[] a = new int[n];
		for(int i = 0;i < n;i++)a[i] = ni();
		return a;
	}
	
	private long[] nal(int n)
	{
		long[] a = new long[n];
		for(int i = 0;i < n;i++)a[i] = nl();
		return a;
	}
	
	private char[][] nm(int n, int m) {
		char[][] map = new char[n][];
		for(int i = 0;i < n;i++)map[i] = ns(m);
		return map;
	}
	
	private int[][] nmi(int n, int m) {
		int[][] map = new int[n][];
		for(int i = 0;i < n;i++)map[i] = na(m);
		return map;
	}
	
	private int ni() { return (int)nl(); }
	
	private long nl()
	{
		long num = 0;
		int b;
		boolean minus = false;
		while((b = readByte()) != -1 && !((b >= '0' && b <= '9') || b == '-'));
		if(b == '-'){
			minus = true;
			b = readByte();
		}
		
		while(true){
			if(b >= '0' && b <= '9'){
				num = num * 10 + (b - '0');
			}else{
				return minus ? -num : num;
			}
			b = readByte();
		}
	}
	
	private static void tr(Object... o) { System.out.println(Arrays.deepToString(o)); }
}